Loretta reads Mother's Questions and Answers:1955-10-12 part 2
|Mother's Questions and Answers: October 12, 1955 (part 2 of 2)|
|by Loretta, 2015 (49:50)|
|Listen on Auroville Radio →|
|Loretta reads Mother's Questions and Answers
October 12, 1955 (part 2 of 2)
This is the second half of the class. In the first half, Mother read the part of the Unknown Man from her play, The Great Secret. Mother wrote this speech, and in just a couple of pages, she gives a very complete – and yet very simple and straightforward – description of what mankind's evolution is going to be, and why. To follow this part of the class (to remember what the students have heard), it's good to have the main points of his monologue in mind.
He says mankind must be born into a new and higher consciousness, the Truth-Consciousness, so that he can realize his own good and the good of others. He says that the reality of Truth-Consciousness is deep within man – the center of his being – just as the reality of Truth-Consciousness is also at the center of the universe.
He speaks about evolution and says that this new consciousness that is coming is the next step for man, and will expand his development far beyond the mind, because this is the aim of evolution. And it is at this time that Nature is very definitely moving towards this change, moving towards a new development of consciousness. It will create in man a 'supra-mental' being, beyond the mind; and give birth to a higher race.
In the first part of this class, Mother answered the question of when this change would come, saying that when a sufficiently large number of consciousnesses were able to receive the new consciousness, it would happen – and happen very quickly.
She said that those who had given themselves completely to this change – those who had reached the point where life as it is was completely intolerable – these would be aware. But those that did not want to take the step of giving their all, would not be aware of the change, at all.
She pointed out that Sri Aurobindo has been here in one form or another, under one name or another, to preside over the great terrestrial transformations. And so, when he tells us 'well, this is the right time', perhaps he knows.
So now we come to the second half of the class. After Mother finished speaking, she asked for questions; and she answers at least ten different kinds of questions in this half of the class. The children are already very familiar with the subject; they've heard about it all their lives, or at least ever since they came to the Ashram. And all sorts of questions keep coming, until finally Mother ends the class by saying, “That's enough for today”.
This class was held about four-and-a-half months before the first manifestation of the supramental consciousness. This was on February 29th of 1956 – the following year. In Mother's answers to some of the questions here, she speaks of certain things that would have to happen in man so that he could evolve into the new being. As the years go by, after the supramental consciousness began to manifest, Mother herself experiences the things that she says have to happen. We know this, because she tells Satprem about it; and he recorded all their conversations in the Agenda. So we have both the tapes, and we have the books that he published. And they're all historical documents. Just like this class is a historical document.
So I'm going to go into some of those things that Mother tells Satprem, after the class. I don't want to describe them now – it's much better to have them after having Mother's answers to the children's questions. Then we already know the things that Mother has said; and then we can hear the things that happened to her.
We don't have the original tape-recording of this class. But Satprem's recordings and the books of the Agenda are available. (Unfortunately we don't have them to play here, but they are available if people are interested.)
So here we are; it's about the middle of the class...
Now if you have something else to say, say it. (To a child) And you, are you among the satisfied ones or among those who want this to change? I won’t ask indiscreet questions!
- Mother, what you have just said implies that the transformation of consciousness and that of life go together, doesn’t it? Because in the text it is said: One must first transform the consciousness, then life...
To tell you the truth, not very much is asked for life at the moment: just a little — what I call little things. It is obvious, yes... you see, if you were asked not to live completely like an animal... not completely, because not to live even partially is at present difficult... however, not to live completely like an animal, that is a change in life. But it doesn’t go further than that. You are not asked to live like ethereal spirits; for the moment we go gently, progressively.
- But this animality...
No, excuse me! You mean that one thinks that he can bring along his animality into the new consciousness?
- No, but until it is ready...
But things are not as sharply cut as that. For the animality to disappear completely, the form must be totally transformed. As long as the body-functioning, for instance, remains what it is, well, we shall participate more than enough in the animality, you see; and this indeed can only disappear when, ah well, we no longer have a heart, lungs, a stomach, and all the rest. We say that this will come much later.
In fact, the only thing which is very important for the moment is the change of consciousness. And don’t think that this is so easy. If you observe yourself attentively, you will perceive that you think, feel, experience and construct like a human animal, that is, like an infrarational being who is three-fourths subconscious, through almost the whole of your day. It is possible that at certain moments you escape from this; but you still need an effort to escape from it. It may happen spontaneously, as by grace, at certain moments; but most of the time you have to make an effort to be able to catch something which is not purely this. At any time whatever of your day, if you take just a small step backwards and observe yourself, you will catch yourself, you will see that. When is it that... suddenly, you see, if I said all of a sudden, here, now, “Look at yourself!” like that, without warning you beforehand, what was it, there in the field of your consciousness? If you catch that, you will see; certainly at least ninety-nine times out of a hundred, it is the animal that’s there; an animal which is a little improved, you know, not altogether a dog, not altogether a monkey, but still not very far from that. There are many things which men have transformed into marvellous virtues, which I have found in animals as spontaneous movements — and they at least have the advantage of not being proud and not having any vanity. They did things spontaneously which, surely, were very remarkable — very remarkable in devotion, abnegation, foresight, educative sense. They did them spontaneously and without writing books on them and boasting about them as something marvellous. Therefore much is needed to come out of the animal, much more than one would think.
- Mother, you were saying just now that it is very close...
What, very close? The event?
Yes. Otherwise we wouldn’t be speaking about it. If it had to happen in some thousands of years, it is obvious that we wouldn’t need to be concerned with it except as a far-off dream.
- So this means that there is at least a fair minority that has changed?
Ah, that!... It is possible; but perhaps not many — I mean perhaps not many people.
There are beings who could look at themselves at any moment whatever, and who wouldn’t find the animal. There are not many of them. One doesn’t speak of things unless one knows them — in any case, one should not.
(To a child) So you have something to say?
- Mother, what is the true reality of the universe?
If you like, in a paradoxical form I would say: What the universe will become.
I could also say: Its starting point and its culmination.
And also: What it is from all eternity.
Now, with all this, make up something.
- Mother, you have said in the text: “An intervention will come and prolong our life...” In that case our life will be prolonged until we could see the coming?
I haven’t read that to you, and it is purposely that I didn’t read it to you. When one writes a drama for a public, one is obliged to say certain things which make it something accessible.
- But it is true, isn’t it?
Whether it is the truth? Yes... That’s all.
- Mother, the appearance of mental man was gradual, wasn’t it, from the animal to man?
That... There was all the same a time when it became a man, isn’t that so? I told you that, from the standpoint of evolution it seems like that. I indeed am not very well up in all this, you see, I can’t tell you how it happened, at least not what science thinks it knows about what happened. I can tell you only what I know.
Well, there was a time when what we call the human form, that is, with human capacities, was ready enough for a being with mental consciousness, entirely conscious, to be able to incarnate in it — and this indeed was truly the first man. Now, historically at what time this happened I can’t tell you; but it was a very long time ago. Sometime ago I came across some numbers, which seemed to me to be absolutely reasonable and accurate — but that was extremely long ago. And for a very long time it was like... a kind of vast and quiet state, as when the sea has reached high-tide and spreads out and is calm. It remained calm like that for a very, very, very, very long time; and it was only after very long that what we call human activity and human civilisation began to take place, and for this, even from the beginning of this till today... we have figures, haven’t we, approximately...? (turning to Pavitra) Pavitra, do you know them?
- (Pavitra) I don’t remember them now.
There are figures, but they are quite enormous. And this is only the period that can be called historic — though it isn’t so, ordinarily reckoning — but still, they have discovered signs, documents, indications, something which can give you an idea of the time. Well, all this happened only very long after the first mental consciousness incarnated in a human form, which had become sufficiently human, you see, to become a man; and probably before this form was produced there must have been numerous trials of Nature which spread out, perhaps over thousands and thousands and millions of years. I don’t know. But there was a time, as I said, when this mental consciousness was able to come and take possession of a form. After this, as I also told you, for very, very long... in order that this form could adapt itself and perfect itself sufficiently to express this consciousness completely, a very, very, very long time was necessary — that is understood. Well, it is more than probable that (not more than probable, certain), that it will happen again in the same way.
There will come a time when a human consciousness is in the required state for a supramental consciousness to be able to enter this human consciousness and manifest.
But it is possible that before this becomes a new race like the human race, it may take very, very long. And it will be done progressively. But as I say, there is one thing: when it happens, it will happen. It does not happen, does not stretch out like a rubber band, you see; there is a time when it happens, when the descent takes place, the fusion occurs, the identification comes about. It can be done in a flash. There is a moment when it occurs. Later it may take very, very, very long; one must not hope that overnight one is going to see supermen springing up here and there. No, it won’t be like that. Only, those who will have done what I have said, those who will have thrown themselves in entirely, risked all for all, those will know it. But they will be the only ones to know; they will know when it takes place.
- The others will not be able even to see?
The others? They will not even be aware of it! They will continue their stupid life, without knowing what has happened.
- But all the same, they will be able to see this superman before them. (Laughter)
- Sweet Mother, what will be the attitude of the superman towards man?
What is the attitude of man towards the animal? No, let us hope that he is a little more kind! (Laughter)
But you must not delude yourself. For the supramental consciousness man is truly stupid. Yes, even with all his perfections, all his realisations, all that, even with all his accomplishments, well, he seems terribly stupid. Only, that’s no reason for ill-treating him. But I don’t think that the superman will ill-treat anyone, just because he will have a consciousness which will be able to pass behind appearances. Let us hope that he will be quite kind.
There we are. That’s all?
I think it is finished, unless someone has a very important question to ask me. Pavitra?
- (Pavitra) What will be man’s attitude towards the superman?
Ah! (Laughter) Let us hope that it is not the same attitude as the one which man has towards all his gods, because he has rather ill-treated them. His prophets and his gods, he has put them upon the cross, he has stoned them, has burnt them alive — indeed, man has behaved rather badly with all those who came to preach a new life to him. Let us hope that man becomes a little more reasonable... Now he would put them in prison.
- But man has also installed them in temples!
No, not the being itself: the image he has manufactured after the event, and of which he has made a... a political action. Excuse me, it is god made in man’s image who has been put in temples and adored, for purely political reasons. But those who were in relation with... those who manifested in themselves the Divine Reality, they have been very badly received, always. History is there to prove it. Now, you see, men don’t throw stones any more, except at the poor Negroes sometimes in America; they don’t burn people alive any more, it is no longer the fashion — but they imprison, that happens. And in fact (I have said this already several times), what saves those who are not altogether men, is that today the world is in such a state of ignorance that people don’t even believe any more in the reality of their power. But certainly if the governments believed in the reality of their power, they would have a bad time of it...
But let us hope that... I should say then as I said for men... that the superman will be quite kind. Well, let us hope for the superman that he will know how to defend himself, that he will have some means of defence, not too visible but sufficient.
- But Mother, if man cannot see him, he doesn’t need to defend himself, does he?
No. It is perhaps his greatest means — the gift of invisibility. (Mother laughs)
You see, you always ask: “But why doesn’t he become a being manifesting supramental forces? Why doesn’t he suddenly become luminous physically? Then we would be able to know that it is he.” Well, you would see what happens to the poor fellow! And it would be only a small thing; to be a little luminous is only a very small thing!
That’s enough for today.
So, here are things from the Agenda. I'm not reading the whole of each conversation on each date, just parts – the things that are most on point. The dates will be there, and people can go to the books or the tapes, and listen to the whole talk. But I'm focusing just on the point simply because we don't have time. Otherwise it's wonderful to hear.
So, in the class, Mother says that when the human body is ready to receive the supramental consciousness, it will come into the body in the same way that the mental consciousness first descended into the bodies which had evolved sufficiently to be able to receive it.
On January 1st, 1969, a new consciousness came into Mother. It was also felt by some other people. Finally she identifies it as the superman consciousness – which will prepare the body for the supramental consciousness.
On January 4th, 1969, Mother begins to tell Satprem about the details. We have some of her experiences with this over a period of months, but not all of them, because I'm sticking on the subject. There are things which this consciousness teaches her which I'm not going to include here. So here's what Mother says:
- “On the 1st, something really strange took place .... And I wasn't the only one to feel it, a few people felt it too. It began just after midnight, but I felt it at 2, and others at 4 in the morning. It was ... I told you a few words about it last time, but the surprising thing is that it didn't correspond to anything I expected (I didn't expect anything), or to any of the things I had felt. It was something very material, I mean it was very external - very outward - and luminous, with a golden light. It was very strong, powerful. But its character was a smiling benevolence, a peaceful joy, and a sort of blossoming in the joy and the light. And it was like a "happy new year," like a wish. I must say it took me by surprise.
- It lasted – I felt it for at least three hours. […] It hasn't gone, it doesn't give the feeling of something that comes only to go away.
- It was far more external than the things I usually feel, far more external .... Hardly mental at all, I mean there was no sense of a "promise" or ... No. It would rather be like ... My own impression was that of an immense personality, immense (meaning that for it, the earth was small, like this :[Mother holds a small object in the hollow of her hands], like a ball), an immense personality, so very benevolent, and coming to ... (Mother seems to gently raise the little ball in the hollow of her hands). It was the impression of a personal god (yet it was ... I don't know) who comes to help. So very strong! And so sweet at the same time, so understanding.
- And it was very external: the body felt it everywhere, everywhere (Mother touches her face, her hands), all over like this.
- What has become of it? I don't know.”
And then four days later, on January 8th of 1969 she tells Satprem:
- “It's the descent of the superman consciousness. I had the assurance of it afterwards.
- It was on the 1st of January after midnight. I woke up at 2 in the morning, surrounded by a consciousness, but so concrete, and NEW, in the sense that I had never experienced that. It lasted, quite concrete and present, for two or three hours, and then it spread out and went to find all those who could receive it. And at the same time I knew it was the consciousness of the superman, that is, the intermediary between man and the supramental being.”
Towards the end of the class that we just heard, there was some talk about the need for the new being to defend and protect himself against bad treatment from ordinary men. And ten days later, on January 18th, 1969, regarding the descent of the superman consciousness Mother says:
- “Oh, did I tell you? The other day, when the [Jain] sadhu came, as soon as he came in (he stood there), this atmosphere came from here up to there (Mother draws a half circle in front of her), it surrounded me like a wall. It was thick, luminous, and what strength it had! But then, it was wholly directed at him (gesture of forward projection). For me, it was visible, very material, like a rampart, about this thick (gesture: about a foot and a half), and it remained there as long as he was there. It was as if to keep him still! (Mother laughs) It was very amusing.
- So this consciousness is very consciously active.”
And then, later, on this same day, Mother says:
- “Today I saw Pondicherry's lieutenant governor (he comes now and then, every two weeks), and other people (a guard of Auroville, who is a Muslim), a bit of everything, and now this consciousness comes: the other day, I told you, it was like a rampart, but today with the governor it was much smaller, of limited proportions (gesture like a beam), but it was there, intact: it was the same thing, only the concentration was less. And it comes between the Action (Mother points to her own body) and the person. It's like a projection of power. And now it has become habitual.
- There is in it a consciousness (something VERY precious) that gives lessons to the body, teaches it what it has to do, that is, the attitude it should have, the reaction it should have .... I had already told you a few times how difficult it is to find the procedure of the transformation when there's no one to give you indications; and it's the response, as it were: "he" comes and tells the body, "Have this attitude, do this, do that in that way." So then the body is happy, it's quite reassured, it can't make a mistake anymore.
- Very interesting.
- It has come like a "mentor" – and PRACTICAL, wholly practical: "This is to be rejected; this is to be accepted; this is to be generalized; this for all inner movements. And it even becomes very material, in the sense that with certain vibrations, it says, "This is to be encouraged"; with others, "This is to be channeled"; with yet others, "This is to be got rid of ...." Small indications of that sort.
- Years ago, in one of the old Talks, when I spoke there, at the Playground, I said, "The superman will probably be first a being of power, so as to be able to defend himself." That's it, it's that experience. It has come back as an experience. And it's because it has come back as an experience that I remembered having said it.”
- “Yes, you said, 'Power's what will come first'.”
- “Yes, Power first.”
- “Because those beings will need to be protected.”
- “Yes, that's right. Well, I've had the first experience for this body: it came like a rampart, it was awesome! An awesome power! Quite out of proportion with the apparent action.”
- “That completely changes the body’s attitude with regard to solutions: there’s no more attachment or sense of extinction, you understand, since the consciousness … it’s the body consciousness that has become independent. And that’s very interesting. In other words, in any physical substance sufficiently developed to receive it, it can manifest.
- It was a rather interesting study, which was made under the auspices of this new consciousness, and so in quite a general way, and very clearly, very clearly And with the sense of a GREAT power. This Consciousness contains a GREAT power. Especially a psychological power, that is, an immunity to any reaction from outside. That's interesting .... All anxiety, fear, desire, covetousness, all that was a whole world which I had always deliberately kept at arm's length because it didn't interest me, but from this new angle some work can be done.
- It's very, very active; this Consciousness is very active.”
- “Yes, I get a sense of solidity.”
- “Yes, that's right! Something very solid.
- That's because it has come to materialize – it hasn't come to ... (gesture up in the clouds): it's looking for instruments.
- I have great hope in little children.”
And then a little later, on March 22nd, 1969, Mother hears something about Auroville from the new consciousness – the new being. And she tells Satprem:
- “Two days ago (not yesterday, the day before), this Consciousness told me something; I said, "Very well," but it went on saying the same thing again and again and again, until I'd written it down! So here it is (Mother holds out a note). And it explained to me why there was "we".
- 'We will strive to make Auroville the cradle of the superman.'
- Ah ... it's important news! (Mother smiles) So then, I said, "Why we?" It answered, "It's because the attempt will be to get those who will live in Auroville to collaborate."
- Then, once I'd written it, it left me in peace, but until I did, it came back again and again.”
In the discussion about man's animality, and the fact that animality must disappear completely, Mother said that animality will disappear when we no longer have a heart, lungs, stomach, and all the rest. She says, “We say that this will come much later”.
In the context of speaking about how the superman will act more harmoniously, she says 'this is how we conceive of it'.
Mother had said that she was meeting Sri Aurobindo at night – and they must also have been discussing all these sorts of things, probably in great detail, when Sri Aurobindo was in the body. It's most likely that “we” means Sri Aurobindo and Mother – not anybody else.
There's a conversation recorded in Mother's Agenda of August 30th of 1969, about the supramental body. It's interesting, because on the first of this year, the superman consciousness descended and became active. Now we hear that the superman's body will evolve into the supramental body. So, August 30th, 1969, Mother says:
- “I spent a good part of the night (almost the whole night till 3 in the morning) with Sri Aurobindo, and he not only showed me and explained to me, but he himself WAS what he was showing me: he was preparing himself for the new creation. And last night he told me, he showed me how this or that thing would be, how the body would be. I remember that when I woke up, he was lying down on a bed, I was kneeling beside the bed, looking at him, and while he was that new body, he at the same time explained to me how the superman's body would be the [supramental being]. And it was so living that even when I woke up, it remained – I can still see it. But the details ... (how can I put it?) the memory doesn't have the precision that enables it to explain (I don't know how to put it). I still have the vision ... it had a color ... it wasn't casting rays of light, not that, but ... and not luminescent like an object, but with a special luminosity which had that light ... a little like Auroville's flower (but it wasn't like that, it looked perfectly natural). He was showing me his body; he was lying down, and showing me his body, saying, "Here is how it is." The form was almost the same, with some ... I still have the memory there (gesture in the atmosphere), but I don't know how to explain.”
Now about two-and-a-half years later, on March 24th 1972, Mother tells Sujata:
- “For the first time, early this morning, I saw myself: my body. I don't know whether it's the supramental body or ... (what shall I say?) a transitional body, but I had a completely new body, in the sense that it was sexless: it was neither woman nor man.
- It was very white. But that could be because I have white skin, I don't know.
- It was very slender (gesture). Really lovely, a truly harmonious form.
- That's the first time.”
And the next day, March 25th, she tells Satprem:
- “Yes, I WAS like that. It was me; I didn't look at myself in a mirror, I saw myself like this (Mother bends her head to look at her body), I was ... I just was like that.
- That's the first time. It was around four in the morning, I think. And perfectly natural – I mean, I didn't look in a mirror, it felt perfectly natural. I only remember what I saw (gesture from the chest to the waist). I was covered only with veils, so I only saw.... What was very different was the torso, from the chest to the waist: it was neither male nor female.
- But it was lovely, my form was extremely svelte and slim – slim but not thin. And the skin was very white, just like my skin. A lovely form. And no sex – you couldn't tell: neither male nor female. The sex had disappeared.
- The same here (Mother points to her chest), all that was flat. I don't know how to explain it. There was an outline reminiscent of what is now, but with no forms (Mother touches her chest), not even as much as a man's. A very white skin, very smooth. Practically no abdomen to speak of. And no stomach. All that was slim.
- I didn't pay any special attention, you see, because I was that: it felt perfectly natural to me. That's the first time it happened, it was the night before last; but last night I didn't see anything. That was the first and the last time so far.”
- “But this form is in the subtle physical, isn't it?”
- “It must be already like that in the subtle physical.”
- “But how will it pass into the physical?”
- “That's the question I don't know.... I don't know.
- I don't know.
- Also, clearly there was none of the complex digestion we have now, or the kind of elimination we have now. It didn't work that way.
- But how? ... Food is already obviously very different and becoming more and more so – glucose, for instance, or substances that don't require an elaborate digestion. But how will the body itself change? ... That I don't know. I don't know.
- You see, I didn't look to see how it worked, for it was completely natural to me, so I can't describe it in detail. Simply, it was neither a woman's body nor a man's – that much is certain. And the outline was fairly similar to that of a very young person. There was a faint suggestion of a human form (Mother draws a form in the air): with a shoulder and a waist. Just a hint of it.
- […] here too there must have been breathing. The shoulders were strikingly broad (gesture), in contrast. That's important. But the chest was neither feminine nor even masculine: only reminiscent of it. And all that - stomach, abdomen and the rest – was simply an outline, a very slender and harmonious form, which certainly wasn't used for the purpose we now use our bodies.
- The two different things – totally different – were procreation, which was no longer possible, and food. […] I haven't the slightest idea what the face looked like. But it didn't seem too, too unlike what it is now.
- What will change a great deal, of course - it had acquired a prominent role - is breathing. That being depended much on it.”
- “Yes, he probably absorbs energies directly.”
- “Yes. There will probably be intermediary beings who won't last, you see, just as there were intermediary beings between the chimpanzee and man.
- But I don't know, something has to happen that has never before happened.
In the class, Mother said that an entirely conscious being with mental capacities incarnated in a human form when that form had evolved to the point where it was ready enough. And that there will come a time when the human consciousness is in the required state for a supramental consciousness to be able to enter, and to manifest.
At the end of 1970, Mother was very ill for several weeks. And after that, Satprem saw her first on January 16th, 1971. She told him quite a bit about the changes that had been going on during that time, and she said, “It's a new functioning”. And Satprem says, “Is it your perception of people and circumstances that has changed? Your way of perceiving things?” And Mother says:
- “Yes, completely – completely. It's very strange....
- Basically, all that time was used to develop the consciousness of the physical being. It really seems as if this physical being (Mother touches her body) had been prepared for another consciousness, because for certain things ... its reactions are entirely different, its attitude is different. I went through a period of total indifference in which the world represented ... meant nothing. And then little by little a kind of new perception grew out of it.
- I am only in the middle of it.”
And then a little later she says:
- “But the change is there – the change is definite. I have changed VERY MUCH, even in character, in comprehension, in the vision of things – very, very much. There's been a whole rearrangement.
- It's really interesting. I think something has been achieved from a general standpoint (Mother makes a grinding gesture); it wasn't just the difficulty of one body or one person: I think something was achieved in terms of preparing Matter to receive in the right way, correctly – it's as if it had been received incorrectly before, and it has learned to receive in the true way.”